Williams missed all or part of 5 seasons (1943-45 (all), 1952-53 (part - played 6 games in '52 and 37 in '53)) to fight in WW2 and Korea. These were his age 25, 26, 27, 34,35 seasons. He missed peak years. He didn't play for three years and came back and hit .342 with 38 HR/123RBI/142R with a .497 OBP - Yes, that's right, he reached base in basically HALF OF HIS PLATE APPEARANCES - in 1946.
He hit 30+ HR and knocked in 110+ RBI in each season he played in from 1941-1947. That adds at least 90 HR to his total and he's in the 600 HR club based solely on his missed 1943-45 seasons and would have put him top 5 all time at the time (I think he would have been 3rd). It gives him over 2100 RBI and 3rd all time, and less than 200 from Hank Aaron's record. This doesn't even account for the missed time in 52' and 53'. ANd he would have surpassed 3,000 hits, being only one of 3 to have 3,000 hits and 600 HR (Aaron and Mays).
So even if Miggy passes him in HR and RBI, and other counting stats, it means nothing, unless he vastly surpasses him.
Williams struck out only 709 times in those almost 10,000 PA. He walk over 2,000 times. No one, not a single player in today's game, even comes close to being in the same league as Williams in this department.
Williams has the 6th highest career average of all time, easily could have held the all time RBI lead and been in the 600 HR club, and has the highest on base percentage for a career of any player (.482), won the Triple Crown TWICE (one in 1942 right before he took 3 years off), 2 time MVP (didn't win it in either season he won the Triple Crown so could have easily won 4), and won the batting title 6 times (including the year he came back after taking 3 years off).
Miggy is the best hitter right now. His Triple Crown is a great season, and it's so hard now to win the Triple Crown that it's an amaxing feat. But he is not a better hitter then Ted Williams. Not even close.
Ted WIlliams played for 13 years after Jackie Robinson broke the color barrier. That argument is ridiculous. And today's pitching is watered down compared to back then, there's twice the teams. ANd yes, they used relievers back then, and yes, Williams saw 95 in the 9th inning.
There is no comparison. Cabrera won a triple crown and is leading in two stats for a second. Williams had two triple crowns. True they were not in succession but there was a war between them and the other year he finished second to a couple of pretty fair ball players Mickey Vernon and Hank Greenberg
The telling stat is OBP. no comparison. Also has anybody seen the ball park that teddy ballgame played in? Fenway is not the easiest park for a left handed hitter to hit home runs in. It is called the Pesky Pole not the Williams Pole. The right field is no short porch like Yankee Stadium. Or that lovely overhang that Greenberg used to use in Tiger Stadium.
It's hilarious to see the old heads talk about the good ole days. You put Miguel Cabrera in the era that Williams played and he'd obliterate those numbers. The same "things were better back then guys" will cry about how starters don't finish games anymore. The flip side of that is how worn down a lot of the pitchers were that Williams saw. Ted Williams never saw a 95 mph fastball in the 9th like cabrera does. Ted WIlliams played in MLB when it was basically racially segregated. He played against mainly white american players. Now the MLB is comprised of the best talent in the WORLD.
I suppose to be fair we should reserve judgment until the end of Cabrera's career, but I find it hard to believe he will ever be a better hitter than Ted Williams. You need to remember Williams missed parts or all of 5 prime seasons due to military service. Had he played those seasons he more than likely would have had close to 700 homers and well over 3000 hits. To me, the "Splendid Splinter" is still the best.
They played in different era's so it is difficult to compare. Williams did not face 7,8, and 9th inning specialists instead he faced tired spent starters. Williams did not face the best pitchers in the world as many of them were doing something else because of being racially barred and there was not a lot of money in baseball yet and it was a poverty situation for many in the minor leagues to learn their craft. In Williams favor, the strike zone was bigger back then, so things even out somewhat. I think Williams was the best left handed pure hitter and Miguel the best right handed pure hitter. Miguel got hurt about a month ago and prior to that was showing how dominant and great he is, hitting pitches a foot outside for homers. Other great hitters you cant throw them a strike, with Miguel it got to where you couldnt throw him anything close to a strike. Another factor is look how few Williams and MIguel strike out, this shows an all around ability that puts them in rare company. Miguel is going to blow past Ted in many categories including homers,rbi,and maybe match Ted in batting titles, but Ted lost prime years to WW2. I would give a slight edge to Ted based on career statistics with the best right and left all time all around hitters going to each player.
No one could hit like Ted Williams. Tell your friend that Williams, as great as his stats are, lost 5 seasons to WWII and the Korean War. Those were prime years as well. Just think what Williams numbers would have been if he had those years back. And I'm not so sure Miggy isn't on PEDs either.
Numbers always lie. I'm not saying Miguel Cabrera is a better hitter, but Ted WIlliams never faced relief pitchers. He had no idea what a closer was. He never had to stare down Papelbon or Rivera in the 9th inning. Never had to deal with setup men either. When a pitcher had a bad game and batters were teeing off on him, he never had to face a relief pitcher... he just got to keep teeing off on the pitcher.
The game was different then, and it favored the hitters. I won't even get into the racial segregation (that was still ongoing in his time), and the fact that players today are bigger, faster, stronger than they were then. Ted Williams was an amazing hitter, the best of his generation. Cabrera is the best hitter of his generation.
I love Miguel Cabrera more than any player now but c'mon Ted Williams is probably the greatest hitter of all time. Miggy is unbelievable but not better than Teddy!
Your friend is a fool. Williams continues as the best pure hitter in baseball history. The "Splendid Splinter still reigns supreme.
As far as I'm concerned this is absolutely impossible to prove one way or the other. Things were different when Ted Williams played.
A friend and I argued this topic today. I say that Ted is still the best hitter that ever lived, but this fool think Miggy is/will end up being better. Here are the stats:
Ted: .344 BA, 482 OBP, 521 HR, 1,839 RBI, 130.4 WAR in 9,791 PA
Miguel: .328 BA, .399 OBP, 365 HR, 1,257 RBI, 55.3 WAR in 7,092 PA
Now Miguel has probably 7-8 years left in his career, so he'll probably surpass Williams in homers. But he'll never catch him in BA, and his OBP isn't even .400.
I'll show his to him after it's been answered. Please tell him what a fool he is.
Not even close.
No
